Can some Saturn games just not be swapped?

[Bootnut]

I've burned a number of Saturn games lately to play on my Model 2 saturn.

A couple at first wouldn't swap, never did get them to work. Once I got a few more games that did work, I learned to swap fairly easily and was successful with the help of my 8Meg cartridge.

I bought some new CDRs recently (Memorex), and I've noticed that only about half of the games want to work, even though I've been burning at 4X speed.

I tested with 2 other brands of CDRs on one of the games that wouldn't work. Those 2 copies also did not work, so perhaps it's not the CDR or the burn itself.

(The game was Sonic Jam, also tried The Last Bronx later)

I tested the discs (that didn't work) with the latest version of SSF, and they did work.

Now I don't know what to think. Is it possible that some games just don't swap properly. or need different timing for the swap? I'm just hoping the games will work when I get a modboard.

I've read the swapping faqs and the boards, but I can't figure this out.

Any ideas?

Thanks

Bootnut

 

[IBarracudaI]

humm... what exactly happens??

Are you patching the isos for your saturn's country code?? (that "8meg" cart may not have the converter ability...)

 

[Bootnut]

I am patching the games for USA/Canada, all except one, which did work, proving the cart does do country conversion. 8)

When I try swapping the games that don't work, the blue sega logo comes up, and nothing happens after that. In the FAQs, that suggests improper timing of the swap. Ok, so I try without the cart so I can time things better, be more in control. No matter what combination of timings I try, it either does the same thing or doesn't work at all (disc not suitable error, recognized as an audio cd only).

2 games, Street Fighter Collection and Saturn Bomberman have loaded a couple of times (after many swap tries without the cartridge in) but I can no longer get them to work. This might suggest a slowly dieing laser/cd unit, but then why do all the working discs work every time?

One other thing I thought of was Analog pad incompatibility.. so I tested with the stock pad plugged in only. Same results.

Frustrating! heh

Bootnut

 

[IBarracudaI]

Try using this swap technique... (without the cart)...

1 - Power on your saturn with the copied cd inserted...

2 - When the copied cd COMPLETELY stops rotating (on the cd-player screen...) , swap for an original cd...

3 - Press RESET... the saturn will read the ring from the original cd... when the cd speeds up (after reading the ring), re-insert the copied cd...

I've found this method to be *100%* accurate... as it doesn't require so much timing in the 2nd (final) swap...

 

[Bootnut]

Excellent!

Thanks for the alternate swap technique! This worked on *EVERY* game that I could not get to run before! Too bad I can't do it with the ram cart, because I'll run out of system nvram very fast! heh.

I noticed that the second (final) swap needs to be done IMMEDIATELY after the disc speeds up, and I find it hard to be that fast. Right now, after about an hour and a number of games later, I'm up to about 70% success. It's easy to tell right away if it wasn't fast enough, so that's ok.

Thanks again, I now have faith in my copies! heh

Bootnut

 

[IBarracudaI]

Congratulations... my job is done here...

 

[MasterAkumaMatata]

Have you ever applied your swap technique on Destruction Derby (JAP)? :devil

 

[IBarracudaI]

Originally posted by MasterAkumaMatata@Mar 18, 2003 @ 08:33 AM

Have you ever applied your swap technique on Destruction Derby (JAP)? :devil

me?

I only have the PAL version... and never tried it... but I don't see why it won't work...

Are you having any toubles??

 

[AntiPasta]

hey Barracuda, thanks for the info! Your trick works great with me! Do you also have something that easy to use with the 4-in-1?

 

[sizone]

there are a few games that even the reset and swap method has trouble booting

wipeout, wipeoutxl, tunnel b1 and magical hoppers can pose some difficulty (actually i don't even think i can get the wipeout games to load w/out using a boot disc)

any game that consists of a really small iso and only 1 or 2 audio tracks will also give you problems if the image isn't padded before burning

 

[mal]

Originally posted by IBarracudaI+Mar 19, 2003 @ 05:04 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IBarracudaI @ Mar 19, 2003 @ 05:04 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-MasterAkumaMatata@Mar 18, 2003 @ 08:33 AM

Have you ever applied your swap technique on Destruction Derby (JAP)? :devil

me?

I only have the PAL version... and never tried it... but I don't see why it won't work...

Are you having any toubles??[/b][/quote]

I believe that Destruction Derby has multiple security ring checks.

 

[IBarracudaI]

Actually this method isn't much different from the usual double-swap...

It just *exploits* the fact that a RESET doesn't clears up the TOC info... this way, the 2nd swap (the tricky one..) seems like it doesn't require an *excelent* timing...

As for multi-checks... well, this method won't change a thing... you'll have to do a quick double-swap... (I say quick because the ring is *read* faster)...

 

[mal]

You also need to know when to do any additional swaps.

This will vary between games. I don't think its impossible to work around, but it could be frustrating.

 

[printf]

Originally posted by mal+Mar 18, 2003 @ 04:57 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mal @ Mar 18, 2003 @ 04:57 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-MasterAkumaMatata@Mar 18, 2003 @ 08:33 AM

Have you ever applied your swap technique on Destruction Derby (JAP)? :devil

I believe that Destruction Derby has multiple security ring checks.[/b][/quote]

I can back this up. Destruction Derby does check for the security ring again during the game.

 

[printf]

Now I got to prove myself wrong on this topic. There's now a version of Destruction Derby that will no longer check for the security ring.

 

[aaron]

i have never understood why so many people have timing issues with swapping on a model 2 saturn. the first time i did it, i read a how-to and it was all like "oh no this is gonna be so awful you're gonna get so pissed and want to smash your saturn against a wall." so i was like, "great. this is going to take fucking forever." but then i tried it and did it on the first try. and i've never had a game that has been burned correctly pizzle out on my due to lack of timing in a swap trick.

this is one of those "i should make a post about this." posts.