Are 2D Fighters Going Downhill?
- Thread starter racketboy
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lordofduct
Established Member
HAHAHAHA, and the evil powers of the Des strike again. This is why I love ya!
As I stated in my post. However, I honestly do not believe that those games (with the exception of the sports titles) were ever hyped to death like they are now. The problem with this is that many of the actual good games fall by the wayside, and developers have less financial incentive to work on anything new. To me, it seems like nearly every major developer is suffering from this syndrome.
I think this is the result of gaming becoming more mainstream. Unfortunate, I know, but whether or not it will ultimately benefit or harm the games being made is yet to be seen. I'll admit that it's nice not to be seen as a member of some kind of weird cult that plays those mind-altering, violent video games, but simply one of many adolescents who plays those mind-altering, violent video games.
Des raises an excellent point about every generation getting its fair share of garbage. With time, the cream always rises to the top.
In regard to the whole retro debate, might some of the disagreement be due to cultural differences? From what I've heard and seen, consoles always get support much longer in Japan than they do in America. Just a thought.
I agree with some of the points made (too many to quote).
There is an enormous amount of crap on my Genny. I've tried out/played all the games in the genres I like, and it's just amazing how bad so many of them are. I can't imagine people having chucked out 50$ for these games.
At the end of the genesis life, I had just half a dozen genny games, and ended up selling them all before I went to college. I only had segaCD and 32X gmes left (because I liked them better than any of the genesis games, or I'd completed the genesis games so many times already).
Then a couple years ago when I rediscovered genesis games (due to their new low prices), I discovered dozens of gems hidden amongst the garbage that I'd missed from the day. Many of these games where never advertized, or were just too expensive for me to pick up in the day. Or they were never on the shelves of my local Funco.
Also, my tastes changed. I used to glamour for the higher end. I didn't want 2D games when I could get games with 3D effects or real 3D polygons. I was really into 3D sims. I didn't want games where you just "walked around and punched things" or "flew around and shot things". It just wasn't enough of a game to pay 50$ for, and I'd done that stuff so much on NES already.
But after wading through all the PS1, N64, DC, PS2, GameCube, X-box games that look great on the cover but have no fun gameplay, I go back and enjoy how much fun all those older 2D games were.
We still do some "new gaming". I've picked up a some games for the DC and PS2. But they're never as fun as their older ancestors (except the DDR series, which is a lot more fun than the old NES powerpad games).
My wife has GTA3 and some PS2 RPGs. But still, when we were on vacation, the only games she picked up was Kirby and Q-bert.
The only games I've found that have some good fun gameplay with the high-end 3D graphics are on the PC. Like the X-wing and Jedi Knight series. The PC was my place for 3D games, since at the time of the PS1 and N64, it was still huge steps ahead of them in terms of power and grahpics. Plus you can play in much larger resolutions, and use better controls like joystick+keyboard.
But even now the PC is going down the tubes. All the consoles and the PC just port the same games around. And the only PC unique stuff is off on this MMORPG tangent.
Also, another angle to it is in 1996 when sega scorned me by dropping support for the segaCD and 32X. It just let them die because it didn't put any support behind them, instead always pushing forward with new projects. They had such promise. I became disenfranchised with the console gaming industry. And junk like the Playstation and N64 was leading the pack and getting all this attention, when they had these new controller styles that sucked and were a beetch to use (and still are), and the 3D graphics were poor and ugly and vastly inferior to what I had on my PC. So I just dumped console gaming in leui of PC gaming for the next 5 years.
JMT.
There is an enormous amount of crap on my Genny. I've tried out/played all the games in the genres I like, and it's just amazing how bad so many of them are. I can't imagine people having chucked out 50$ for these games.
At the end of the genesis life, I had just half a dozen genny games, and ended up selling them all before I went to college. I only had segaCD and 32X gmes left (because I liked them better than any of the genesis games, or I'd completed the genesis games so many times already).
Then a couple years ago when I rediscovered genesis games (due to their new low prices), I discovered dozens of gems hidden amongst the garbage that I'd missed from the day. Many of these games where never advertized, or were just too expensive for me to pick up in the day. Or they were never on the shelves of my local Funco.
Also, my tastes changed. I used to glamour for the higher end. I didn't want 2D games when I could get games with 3D effects or real 3D polygons. I was really into 3D sims. I didn't want games where you just "walked around and punched things" or "flew around and shot things". It just wasn't enough of a game to pay 50$ for, and I'd done that stuff so much on NES already.
But after wading through all the PS1, N64, DC, PS2, GameCube, X-box games that look great on the cover but have no fun gameplay, I go back and enjoy how much fun all those older 2D games were.
We still do some "new gaming". I've picked up a some games for the DC and PS2. But they're never as fun as their older ancestors (except the DDR series, which is a lot more fun than the old NES powerpad games).
My wife has GTA3 and some PS2 RPGs. But still, when we were on vacation, the only games she picked up was Kirby and Q-bert.
The only games I've found that have some good fun gameplay with the high-end 3D graphics are on the PC. Like the X-wing and Jedi Knight series. The PC was my place for 3D games, since at the time of the PS1 and N64, it was still huge steps ahead of them in terms of power and grahpics. Plus you can play in much larger resolutions, and use better controls like joystick+keyboard.
But even now the PC is going down the tubes. All the consoles and the PC just port the same games around. And the only PC unique stuff is off on this MMORPG tangent.
Also, another angle to it is in 1996 when sega scorned me by dropping support for the segaCD and 32X. It just let them die because it didn't put any support behind them, instead always pushing forward with new projects. They had such promise. I became disenfranchised with the console gaming industry. And junk like the Playstation and N64 was leading the pack and getting all this attention, when they had these new controller styles that sucked and were a beetch to use (and still are), and the 3D graphics were poor and ugly and vastly inferior to what I had on my PC. So I just dumped console gaming in leui of PC gaming for the next 5 years.
JMT.
Here are the important things for me on new consoles:
Strong Japanese developer support.
Excellent first-party wireless support -- both controllers and networking.
Non-existant load times.
A form factor that fits in with an entertainment center.
Has a high-quality sound and video output for HD displays.
At this point graphics are not as important -- it's making the gaming experience better and able to fit into an adult's lifestyle.
Unfortuanately I just contributed to the de-railing of my own thread 🙁
Strong Japanese developer support.
Excellent first-party wireless support -- both controllers and networking.
Non-existant load times.
A form factor that fits in with an entertainment center.
Has a high-quality sound and video output for HD displays.
At this point graphics are not as important -- it's making the gaming experience better and able to fit into an adult's lifestyle.
Unfortuanately I just contributed to the de-railing of my own thread 🙁
To me, the Dreamcast doesn't really belong to either group. If feels as if it belongs to its own little group of awesomeness.
But that's just me.
I think the reverse is worse. My chinese buddy "Phirrip" can't stand old games, just because they're old, outdated, "ugly". He's always looking for that newer, shinier game. We hammered his stubborn butt into a corner over Counter-Strike, though. He was trying to explain why CS on HL2 is "better", when its the same damn thing. At least they took riot shields back out, but it's still a retarded headshot fest.
Phillip: "Press the yee button! THE YEE BUTTON!"
John: "The what?" *bomb explodes*
axelblazeadam
Staff member
I really dont like a lot of the games around that try offer too much freedom.
I prefer games to have more focus like most 2d games do instead of many modern games which try to be a Jack of all trades but fail with most of them.
Take the GTA games, parts of them are very good, but other parts seem to be put there just for sake of it and dont offer any enjoyment.
I prefer games to have more focus like most 2d games do instead of many modern games which try to be a Jack of all trades but fail with most of them.
Take the GTA games, parts of them are very good, but other parts seem to be put there just for sake of it and dont offer any enjoyment.
Phillip hates ALL old games 2D or 3D. If it's "ugly", he won't play it. I myself remain nostalgic for the days of old, but I still enjoy new games, if they're good. I think my PC gaming experience draws me to look forward to new stuff, even as my console experience draws me back to the old days.Originally posted by RolfWrenWalsh@Tue, 2004-12-07 @ 06:50 PM
That's how my friend Travis is. He says he feels "limited" by 2D games.
:looney
Yeh there are more overhyped pieces of shit now more than ever. It makes a gamer jaded.
But these days, a game developer doesn't just make a game. A good game. A game that makes them money. They give "birth" to frachises. Ongoing cash. Lucrative sequels. Endless spinoffs. Mass Market branding. Bigger and Better Guns. More explosions. Niftier cars. Little upgrades that offer a non-gamer a reason to buy their next game. And the one after.
Sure. This sort of thing may have happened in the past. But to todays extent?
I recently bought Jak 3. And by COMPARISON to Jak 2, it's not much of a game. Repetitive missions. An utterly POINTLESS wasteland. An emphasis on vehicles to use in your pointless wasteland. And a city that's been scaled down because fans complained. It's not that much of a game.
Then there's Killzone. A beautiful looking game, if you forget that every environment is repeated three times per stage. What's beautiful once soon loses it's novelty. It's a textbook example of lazy game design.
SAN ANDREAS. A good game. But how much better to Vice City? 9 HOURS into the game and i finally get to my first fun mission. It takes too long to get to the cream filling. That's TOO MUCH WORK!
And so it goes on. Today's games don't excite me like the games of old. Games like Yoshi's island, Secret of Mana and Guardian Heroes.
Either today's games have lost their magic, or I've lost mine.
But these days, a game developer doesn't just make a game. A good game. A game that makes them money. They give "birth" to frachises. Ongoing cash. Lucrative sequels. Endless spinoffs. Mass Market branding. Bigger and Better Guns. More explosions. Niftier cars. Little upgrades that offer a non-gamer a reason to buy their next game. And the one after.
Sure. This sort of thing may have happened in the past. But to todays extent?
I recently bought Jak 3. And by COMPARISON to Jak 2, it's not much of a game. Repetitive missions. An utterly POINTLESS wasteland. An emphasis on vehicles to use in your pointless wasteland. And a city that's been scaled down because fans complained. It's not that much of a game.
Then there's Killzone. A beautiful looking game, if you forget that every environment is repeated three times per stage. What's beautiful once soon loses it's novelty. It's a textbook example of lazy game design.
SAN ANDREAS. A good game. But how much better to Vice City? 9 HOURS into the game and i finally get to my first fun mission. It takes too long to get to the cream filling. That's TOO MUCH WORK!
And so it goes on. Today's games don't excite me like the games of old. Games like Yoshi's island, Secret of Mana and Guardian Heroes.
Either today's games have lost their magic, or I've lost mine.
Des-ROW, I resent that you imply that my dislike of most new games/systems has to do with blind obstinance rather than the fun and appeal of the games/systems themselves.
The hatred and frustration was explained in my prior post.
I always felt this was a board dedicated to and a community of "Retro" gamers. Why else do we talk about and drool over old Sega, Nintendo, TG, etc. systems and games? I think discussions about PoS2 games should be banned.
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