What do you think the most overrated game(s) is?

[SkankinMonkey]

Originally posted by Des-ROW@Mon, 2004-11-01 @ 01:29 AM

"All current non-Asian RPGs are GTA clones with some action battle-system, stats and some dialogues."

"Let's experiment. Let's make games about going around "freely", killing people, mass-murder, Matrix effects, no story at all, big guns, big cars, explosions, rappers, horrible MTV-based soundtracks, and several other tools to help people do what they do not dare to do in real life.

Oh, and if we make a fighting game, let's make it the most disgusting a worthless thing ever created. But let's make it "controvertial"."



Good job overgeneralizing

In the other hand, I am not suprised by you, a male who is not "willing to concede legitimate points when he is wrong" just because he has a major.

[post=122259]Quoted post[/post]​

You see, these are not specific examples. I could say the same thing about RPGs. Them having their characters, speech, movement, FMV, boss battles.

And lets not make a game straightforward, let's give it mini-games.

And I am willing to concede points, but when the point you are making is 'no good games from a particular genre come out of any country but japan' well, that's just ridiculous. I think with a world view like that, you really need to go outside and explore the world, or in this case, explore the plethora of games coming from non-asian markets.

 

[SkankinMonkey]

Originally posted by CrazyGoon@Mon, 2004-11-01 @ 01:31 AM

For a series it's good. :devil

[post=122260]Quoted post[/post]​

Yea, I'd be willing to concede that, but to really call FF a series, well, it's kinda disjointed and unrelated in any real manner, it's more of a marketing ploy.

 

[tsumake]

Jesus Fucking Christ! Why don't we just create a War Room like neo-geo.com and create mindless flame wars. These are just games! Since we're all Sega Fans, and a lot of us from a Western country, we're bound to like all kinds of games. I like VG RPGS like the FF series, and I like CRPGs like Fallout (actually I friggin love Fallout, but that's just me).

Please, please calm down. I like this forum for the fact that these kind of juvenile arguments are rare. I hate trying to flunge through "Dinkins is a cawksuka" posts on neo-geo.com, please keep the cool. Please?

 

[Des-ROW]

Originally posted by SkankinMonkey@Mon, 2004-11-01 @ 02:36 PM

And I am willing to concede points, but when the point you are making is 'no good games from a particular genre come out of any country but japan' well, that's just ridiculous. I think with a world view like that, you really need to go outside and explore the world, or in this case, explore the plethora of games coming from non-asian markets.

[post=122261]Quoted post[/post]​

I have money, I travel a lot, and I buy almost anything with good reviews, games or DVDs.

In other words, I buy and try almost every game released.

Some American games I truly like and enjoy, but overall, the games that I like and play the most are Japanese. This is why I believe the best games are the Japanese releases.

Regarding Western RPGs, I have not tried a single one that has impressed me in any way, I do not like the chara design, I do not like the "battle-system" (most have action gameplay, and I hate that), I do not like the "free-roam" thing, I do not like the weak and practically non-existant stories, I do not like the personality-less charas, mediocre music, I find to many things in them I do not like. In the other hand, I play games like Grandia, Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Shin Megami Tensei, Star Ocean, etc, and I love them in every way.

 

[CrazyGoon]

Originally posted by SkankinMonkey@Mon, 2004-11-01 @ 12:38 AM

Yea, I'd be willing to concede that, but to really call FF a series, well, it's kinda disjointed and unrelated in any real manner, it's more of a marketing ploy.

[post=122262]Quoted post[/post]​

It's both (a series and a marketing ploy).

Marketing ploy - simply slap the name of the franchise onto the game and you have a marketing ploy.

Series -

But don't get confused with TV series' and videogame series' - unlike TV series which is based on storylines, and the following through of the story, games are based on gameplay, and how the gameplay follows through. Storylines aren't necessary for games - they never were, but as we continue through this age, people seem to expect more and more games to have indepth stories.. kind of trying to bridge the gap between cinima and videogame. A gap that is there for a reason! Same can be said with the increasing amount of shity FMV you have to go through in games. In this example (FF), each game contains (if it doesn't, it should) the same gameplay. Which I believe it does, ya? Official brand the series with the title of the game, or subtitle. Eg. FF1, FF2.

So in relation to "sticking with the mold" - regardless of the storyline of Final Fantasy, it's gameplay has (I hope), "stuck with the mold" - stayed with what has worked (talking about gameplay), and have officially branded each game as apart of the series through the title. Therefore, people who like the game will know what to expect, as goes with those who dislike the game. Win win! If a company wants to change the gameplay for an established series, then it can still use the name of the franchise, but should definately start a new series. This way, people will still know what to expect from the series', even after it's gone through dramatic changes, since it has been divided into two groups (series). Therefore, just like I said above, people who like the game will know what to expect, as goes with those who dislike the game. Triple win!

And BTW, this argument doesn't work/ apply for those who play Final Fantasy (or any other game in any genre) for story rather than gameplay, since they don't care how the game plays (thus doesn't care whether the gameplay changes in a series or not) as long as they get the story. Beware of that

 

[CrazyGoon]

Originally posted by Des-ROW@Mon, 2004-11-01 @ 12:49 AM

I have money, I travel a lot, and I buy almost anything with good reviews, games or DVDs.

In other words, I buy and try almost every game released.

[post=122268]Quoted post[/post]​

You don't say!

Some American games I truly like and enjoy, but overall, the games that I like and play the most are Japanese. This is why I believe the best games are the Japanese releases.

That's fine, nothing wrong with that. But there is a big difference between this and saying "All non-Japanese RPG games are horrible, and over-rated." You see?

Regarding Western RPGs, I have not tried a single one that has impressed me in any way, I do not like the chara design, I do not like the "battle-system" (most have action gameplay, and I hate that), I do not like the "free-roam" thing, etc.

That's because the (so-called) "Action-RPG" is Not an RPG! Can ya dig it? So all this time you have said that you dislike a completely different genre - and let me tell you, there is nothing that says "only games made in certain parts of the world can be of a certain genre". This "Action-RPG" genre that you dislike, (which you give the impression that Japan doesn't release these sort of games), actually does inhabit some very nice (If I say so myself) Japanese games! Example? Sure: "Y's VI: Ark of Napishtim" surely fits the description. Convinced? :devil

 

[Tagrineth]

I think we can all agree that Koreans make the best games.

/me resumes playing GunBound for a few minutes

 

[ExCyber]

This "Action-RPG" genre that you dislike, (which you give the impression that Japan doesn't release these sort of games), actually does inhabit some very nice (If I say so myself) Japanese games!

Quintet did some right fantastic ass-kicking in that department, as did Ancient.

I do not like the "free-roam" thing, I do not like the weak and practically non-existant stories, I do not like the personality-less charas, mediocre music, I find to many things in them I do not like.

I have to agree with this in large part, though not so much in reference to action/adventure/RPG hybrids, whatever you want to call them (which suffer much less from these elements; The Legend of Zelda, for instance, fits all of those except for "mediocre music" and it's still a fine game). Although I do believe Western companies are quite capable of making good games (I love Metroid Prime, Gauntlet Legends / Dark Legacy, and the THPS games, for example), I have yet to see one tackle RPGs in a way that seemed anything other than mediocre at best, with the possible exception of SSI's AD&D and Buck Rogers games (my memory's too fuzzy to call those clearly). That's not to say it can't be done or that I've played every Western RPG ever made, but I do see a trend there.

I'm not sure, but I think part of what's happened is that many Western RPGs seem to be tied more heavily to the concepts of pen-and-paper RPGs, in which the real richness of the game comes from the players creating rich characters, and someone who is used to something like FF or its derivatives will find the stat/item management and the breadth of the possible paths/actions absolutely tedious (a perfect example of this would be Might and Magic; the Ultima games have a good amount of it too IIRC), and the story utterly lacking (pen-and-paper RPGs generally just have backstory and scenario events - the players make the real story - but when these are computerized you don't get that aspect).

I think it's fair to say that there is something going on here, but I think it's with regard to specific design traditions and not (by way of disclaimer; I don't contend that anyone's really advocating this) some idiotic concept of genetic or cultural superiority.

 

[it290]

Okay, besides Fallout being the best RPG I've ever played, the best RPG story I've ever experienced comes in the form of another game: Planescape Torment. Des-ROW, maybe you should give that one a shot, as all the main characters are well defined and voiced.

 

[Pyrite]

So ... what you guys think the most overrated games are?

 

[ExCyber]

I'm going to have to go with:

- Final Fantasy 7

- Metal Gear Solid

Both fine games in their own right, but both rehashes of their prequels in almost every way that matters, and lauded primarily due to being the first Playstation and first 3D incarnations of their respective series.

 

[Kisou]

Sorry to pull this month-old thread up. Just had to say something

I'm surprised that no one's mentioned Radiant Silvergun. It seems like most people have heralded it as the end all, be all of shooters.

I've played it a bit and I can say, it wasn't all that impressive. The gimmicks in the scoring system is just...a tad too much to make the game more enjoyable than it was. I mean, I thought most people would want to play a shooter to blow stuff up, not to selectively destroy an enemy of a certain colour or fiddle around with 7 or so weapons that you'll only use a few times in certain situations.

Don't get me wrong, Ikaruga had a somewhat similar system (with the polarities) but the game didn't make you feel like you were bound to the system or had too much of a selection in weapons. So, naturally I pick Ikaruga over RSG over simplicity.

Radiant Silvergun just seems so demanding to fully enjoy the game.

My opinion, of course

 

[it290]

I dunno, I love Ikaruga, but the game really does force you into one 'right' way to play the game, if you're playing for score anyway. There's really no improvisation whatsoever, you have to follow the pattern if you want to get the best score. I feel it's somewhat overrated, but still a great game. As for RS, unfortunately I haven't had much time with it, so I can't really rate it.

As for overrated games, what about the MGS series (especially 2)? Fun games, yes, but if you removed all the cutscenes you'd be left with about an hour worth of actual game time. I really wish they would include a 'no cutscene' mode in these things. You can't even skip the codec sequences directly! Also, the storylines are pretty much stupid, IMHO (again, especially 2). I've seen cheesy 80's action flicks with better plots.

 

[Nadius]

I just don't get The Sims.... I've played it for a night, but it's not fun. It's just doing thing's i can do in the real life including the stuff I'd leave out, like the pooping.... is it even a game?

And I guess, as adult, I can say the Konami arcade beat 'em ups are overrated. But that maybe because I've gone through them several times and there's virtually no replay value.

On the other hand, I don't think that Secret of Evermore got the credit it deserved.

 

[CrazyGoon]

I hate the sims too! I also hated tamagotchi, which is where I believe all those game "games" originated from. Keep in mind, my view of an online "RPG" (your classic "MMORPG") is basically tamagotchi with online chat functions...

And I've passed minesweeper on expert two times! Go da minesweeper!

 

[SamIAm]

Originally posted by Kisou@Sat, 2004-12-04 @ 08:08 AM

Radiant Silvergun just seems so demanding to fully enjoy the game.

My opinion, of course

[post=125116]Quoted post[/post]​

And you are entitled to it. However, I just want to put in my own 2 cents. Rather than write out a long review, I'll just point out the irony that the reasons why you don't like RSG are the reasons why I love it. I also think that the weapons and enemy patterns often offers more flexibility in playing style than Ikaruga, and many other chaining shmups as well. This is especially true during boss fights, which make up around half the game. I do finally have to add that if you're only using some weapons once or twice, I guarantee that you are using too rigid a technique to get through the game.

Anyway, most overrated game? I personally don't like RPGs at all (which is weird, because I used to), and the craziness surrounding them really bugs me. However, if I can't use a whole genre, I'll just narrow it a bit to something else: Grand Theft Auto. I've played these games many times with many friends, and I have never been impressed.

 

[CrazyGoon]

Originally posted by SamIAm@Mon, 2004-12-06 @ 08:54 PM

Grand Theft Auto. I've played these games many times with many friends, and I have never been impressed.

[post=125343]Quoted post[/post]​

The original, or the 3D ones? I remember growing fond of the orignal back in the day. Never had I played a game which you need to drive a car bomb to destination under a certain time limit ..Get's the adrenalin pumping when your constantly checking the timer whilst frantically dodging traffic :devil. Or having to be a chauffeur in a limousine, escorting a traitor to an unmarked warehouse whilst a mad frenzy of police are chasing after you. Fun stuff And the soundtrack was a classic!

The most important things Rockstar ommited from the 3D GTAs is the multiplier and the lives - oh, and the target amount of money needed to progress to the next level.

 

[M3d10n]

This thread is a travesty. Who the fuck opened this can 'o fire?

It's obvious where this was going to head to, since not everyone likes every game, it depends too much on personal experience, and everyone has a bunch of popular or highly-regarded games they are not-so-keen on, or games they don't simply get at all.

Every game has a proposal. If you don't get it, odds are you won't enjoy it. If you do, it might be the best thing ever since sliced bread.

I, for example, share some opinios with DES on Western RPGs. At least on Western fantasy RPGs, since I haven't played Fallout nor KOTOR (I really need to play Fallout one of these days) - I base my view on the games I played.

I mean, the games that I tried playing, because for ages I truly tried playing many of those PC RPGs, but while I could get on and play for a while, I think I didn't get them and couldn't play them to the end.

My last attempt was Neverwinter Nights, and it bored the fuck out of me before I could even get out the first city.

There was a plot going on, but there were no characters around to make me care about it. Everyone in the game felt like a mindless drone: no ambitions, no personality, no emotions at all. I understand that for the main character, but do ALL characters need to sound like robots? If I can't attach to at least a few of them, I don't care about them, and I don't feel like saving the world they live at.

I had a similar problem with The Legend of Zelda: The Ocarina of Time: I was supposed to save a world where there wasn't much to save actually. Ganon could come and slave them all that I wouldn't care. Also, almost all the characters did seem to exist for the sole purpose of aiding me in my mission, and that pissed me off. Even if Wind Waker was way more cartoonish, and even if Majora's Mask was way darker and menacing, the worlds in both games felt much more alive and easier to relate to. The only reason that kept me playing OOT was because there was a little adventuring in there (solving all puzzles -> solving the game), and I enjoy solving such things, like undoing a huge knot or solving crosswords.

NVW didn't even had such kind of adventuring in it... aside solving the generic drones' problems, all that was left was raise tons of stats and collect tons of items I need higher stats to use, or that won't fit in my inventory.

Obviously I didn't get it, as well as people who didn't get Grandia (the first one, of course - the 2nd one is a ball of mediocre 'tard), a game I regard as one of the finest gaming experiences I ever had.

Most overrated games IMO:

- Whole MK series: the gameplay has always been mediocre, IMO

- Smash Bros: I REALLY don't get this one...

 

[racketboy]

I never got into Zelda. I get frustrated by having to run back and forth everywhere trying to find stuff and solve stuff.

Games shouldn't be work.

And I agree with M3d10n's last few.

I never liked Mortal Kombat -- I was a SF fan from day one.

And Smash Bros is like fun the first couple rounds you play, but kinda gets old fast.

 

[Rorscach]

You know what i haven't seen in a while? A good RPG.