Sky Rocketing Gas Prices
- Thread starter RitualOfTheTrout
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SkankinMonkey
Established Member
This is america we're talking about.
A lot of Americans don't have a feasible way to get to work without a car. Biking and walking are fine options if the roads are actually built in a way that makes them feasible, and you're not a ridiculous distance away from work, but a lot of Americans aren't in that kind of situation and absolutely depend on their car for their livelihood. Not every city cares about maintaining decent public transportation either. So when fuel prices go up, plenty of Americans have good reason to complain - essentially the only other option they have is to quit their job, pack up and move somewhere else. In this case it may seem obvious to say "move closer to where you work", but housing in most major metro areas is ridiculously expensive outside of the ghetto.
On the flip side, many people in urban areas don't have cars. It absolutely boggles my mind that there are people who think that the people trapped in New Orleans all just decided it would be a fun time to stick around and watch the hurricane...
Well as ExCyber stated, many Americans can't go without gas. It's hard to boycot the oil companies when you need gas to get to work. I live about 5 minutes away (by car) from my place of employment and I still can't completely give up gasoline. Public transportation sucks around here (except for traveling from coastal city to coastal city, the trains do an okay job of that) and my church is 15 minutes away by car, my fiance goes to school about an hour and a half away.
SkankinMonkey
Established Member
You have to realize that America is run by people with oil interests at heart. George Bush and his dad are huge oil tycoons and Cheney is former CEO of Halliburton which is making BILLIONS in Iraq.
Notice that all of the actual work to make cars less gas reliant comes outside of the US (Toyota, Honda).
Also, America is based on a much larger scale than most other countries are (maybe australia is an exception). But most people live anywhere from 15-20 minutes from their work, and that's highway driving. Public transportation SUCKS in america for this kind of transit. European and Asian countries have public tranportation figured out much better thanAmerica does, and that needs to change before any problems can be fixed on a large scale.
I've done some reading, and some say that this year may be the peak production year for oil... of course, that may not be true, but I think it's feasible that within' the next 4-5years we could get to that point.
Gas prices are never going to go back down in a drastic way, extreme legislation and regulation won't happen because noone in D.C. has the balls to do it. And we can't rely on the private sector to regulate themselves without some sort of consumer uprising(which may happen, but probably accomplish very little)... We're stuck like this, whether we like it or not, so I'm just gonna bare down, get a bike, get a small, gas effecient car, and do more of the shopping I would go out of town for on the internet.
I may write some letters to my congressmen, won't do any good, but at least I can say I did something.
I will say though, I think Europeans and most other developed countries figured this out a long time ago by making great public transporation available. We Americans think we can be so bold to be completely different and get away with it every time because we're American. But we're gonna learn real fast that maybe, just maybe, the rest of the world was right and we might be wrong. Sad way to learn though.
Gas prices are never going to go back down in a drastic way, extreme legislation and regulation won't happen because noone in D.C. has the balls to do it. And we can't rely on the private sector to regulate themselves without some sort of consumer uprising(which may happen, but probably accomplish very little)... We're stuck like this, whether we like it or not, so I'm just gonna bare down, get a bike, get a small, gas effecient car, and do more of the shopping I would go out of town for on the internet.
I may write some letters to my congressmen, won't do any good, but at least I can say I did something.
I will say though, I think Europeans and most other developed countries figured this out a long time ago by making great public transporation available. We Americans think we can be so bold to be completely different and get away with it every time because we're American. But we're gonna learn real fast that maybe, just maybe, the rest of the world was right and we might be wrong. Sad way to learn though.
I think a large reason why public transportation sucks so much in the US, is that a large percentage of the population has private transportation and most of them use it when given the choice. This makes public transit economically unsustainable except in places where there is enough volume or enough dissincentive to private transport to give it a large enough market.
Add in the fact that the US is quite large as countries go and quite spread out in many places and it's no surprise that public transit sucks.
Add in the fact that the US is quite large as countries go and quite spread out in many places and it's no surprise that public transit sucks.
For example, go into a *big* US city, like NYC or Los Angeles or Washington DC, and you'll find well-used mass- and public transit systems. Busses and subways are packed with people. You can walk out of your apartment or brownstone, walk two or three blocks to the subway station, and get on a train that'll take you two or three blocks from where you have to go. Now come out to the rest of the country, where it's a mile and a half walk to the nearest bus stop, three or four changes until you get to a bus on the route that'll get you where you're going (paying a buck for each bus you have to get on, if you don't have an easypass which costs $40 a month or so), and then you get there and still have to walk another mile and a half. Or it gets even worse in the more rural areas, where there's five miles of farmland between each property, and no economicaly feasable way to run a busline.
What we really need are StarTrek style transporter beams.
:thumbs-up:
But before the government would allow such a thing to exist, they'd have to find a way to run it on oil so the saudis who pay for their election campaigns will benefit.
What we really need are StarTrek style transporter beams.
:thumbs-up:
But before the government would allow such a thing to exist, they'd have to find a way to run it on oil so the saudis who pay for their election campaigns will benefit.
Scared0o0Rabbit
Established Member
I for instance rely heavily on private transportation. Public transportation wouldn't even kind of work for my job. I need to get to anywhere between 12-30 houses on some days. Most weeks for my job I end up needing to drive 400-800 miles...
If it could be done with public transportation I'd be all for it, but it really can't.
If it could be done with public transportation I'd be all for it, but it really can't.
Wow, GM made a car in Brazil that runs off 3 different types of fuel...
You don't have to make ethanol from just corn...
A self-taught mechanic did this...
I agree, public transportation would not be the end all to this problem.. where I live it probably would not work very well either.. but there is a solution, the problem though is that we spent all of the 80's and 90's not caring and now it's catching up to us.
The government can put a cap on gas prices, Hawaii just did this recently, and hopefully more states will follow, and hopefully get the attention of the federal government to consider it.
And the time is now to start building an infrastructure for alternative fuels to exists in the U.S. And the Flex Fuel cars mentioned in the above article would easily accomodate people if a certain type of fuel was not available at a nearby station. Top that off with gas/electric hybrid technology, vaporizers, and even solar energy it would no be a giant leap to get a car running 100-200mi to the gallon of whatever fuel it is using.
The technology is there, it's always been there, and the solution is simple, it's just the problem that is huge.
You don't have to make ethanol from just corn...
A self-taught mechanic did this...
I agree, public transportation would not be the end all to this problem.. where I live it probably would not work very well either.. but there is a solution, the problem though is that we spent all of the 80's and 90's not caring and now it's catching up to us.
The government can put a cap on gas prices, Hawaii just did this recently, and hopefully more states will follow, and hopefully get the attention of the federal government to consider it.
And the time is now to start building an infrastructure for alternative fuels to exists in the U.S. And the Flex Fuel cars mentioned in the above article would easily accomodate people if a certain type of fuel was not available at a nearby station. Top that off with gas/electric hybrid technology, vaporizers, and even solar energy it would no be a giant leap to get a car running 100-200mi to the gallon of whatever fuel it is using.
The technology is there, it's always been there, and the solution is simple, it's just the problem that is huge.
Scared0o0Rabbit
Established Member
The problem with hybrids is the batteries wear out. Then you end up with lots of REALLY toxic stuff to dispose of, and they're really expensive to replace (to the tune of nearly completely offsetting your gas savings).
The answer isn't to cap gas prices, doing that will actually limit the amount of fuel we'll have access to.
Right now we need foreign gas to come in as we don't have near the refining capacity we need. To do this we need gas prices to actually go up. If the gov't doesn't put a cap on gas prices, then gas prices will probably continue to rise for the next month or two to somewhere between $3.50 and $4.00 a gallon, and there will be some shortages, but the costs will make people limit the amount they use. In the mean time the higher prices will bring in foreign providers, which will help greatly with teh supply problems we're going to be having. Eventually in the next few months, gas should come back down quite a bit.
If we were to put caps on the price of gas, we'd definetly be looking at a severe shortage of gas, as we NEED foreign gas right now.
Half the problem is that we need more refineries. We need to be able to make more gas from our oil, but no one wants to live near a refinery. =/
The answer isn't to cap gas prices, doing that will actually limit the amount of fuel we'll have access to.
Right now we need foreign gas to come in as we don't have near the refining capacity we need. To do this we need gas prices to actually go up. If the gov't doesn't put a cap on gas prices, then gas prices will probably continue to rise for the next month or two to somewhere between $3.50 and $4.00 a gallon, and there will be some shortages, but the costs will make people limit the amount they use. In the mean time the higher prices will bring in foreign providers, which will help greatly with teh supply problems we're going to be having. Eventually in the next few months, gas should come back down quite a bit.
If we were to put caps on the price of gas, we'd definetly be looking at a severe shortage of gas, as we NEED foreign gas right now.
Half the problem is that we need more refineries. We need to be able to make more gas from our oil, but no one wants to live near a refinery. =/
That invention with cars running on gas vapors is awesome. I cant understand why something like that isnt pickued up and worked on by companies.. Its like nobody is interested.
What will end up happening is the oil companies will buy his invention and own the rights then nobody will be able to have one. Things like that are there worst nightmare.
What will end up happening is the oil companies will buy his invention and own the rights then nobody will be able to have one. Things like that are there worst nightmare.
Well, the general view from the rest of the world is that America is a Car culture, and that I agree. Almost everyone uses a private car as a mode of transportation. I'm from Nebraska, and there's no way to get around without a car. That is, unless the Old Market starts to develop...
Anyway, perhaps part of the problem is that we have such a developed interstate system. Before, we relied on either airplane or trains to get us across the states. Perhaps if we had grown accustomed to taking other, more public (public in the sense of having to sit with other people) transportation, our perception of transportation would be different.
Granted, Germany has a similar extensive transport system, but they have had public transportation since at least the early twentieth century. I am not phrasing this right, but you know what I mean.
So why not the States? We are a much more individualist country. Urban planning is not really a part of our culture. Look at New York. Talk about a city that was built in a haphazard fashion! But because of it, the city has a unique beauty to it. We plan inasmuch as lay out a proper foundation for a city, but in terms of actually moving the populace or items around, we tend to leave that to individuals. In other words, we supply the means of doing something, but not the actual motive.
To be quite honest, I think we should use this price hike to re-evaluate our connection to automoblies. Perhaps some companies can create some low-cost comfortable transit systems? I think we could make something like that. Americans like things fast, and I'm pretty sure a fast transit system, like a private bus company or similar service, would do well in some cities. While I am well aware of what happened in LA with the Bus system (the auto manufacturers basically threw them out of business), we are in a different situation now, so who knows?
Another facet is that, like what was said before, we live in a big country. Everything is really parced out in comparison to places in Europe. The car, in essence, becomes an extension of our feet in order to cover large distances. The confidence in which people drive in the states is the same as one who walks. Personally, I prefer using my two feet to get me places, but that's just me. I don't think there's anything wrong with such driving habits, save the fact that you don't get the beneficial excercise from it (believe me, walking can really get you in shape).
Perhaps people should start building up their own communities, infuse them with culture and productivity. So that, after work, you can drive home, and them walk around your community to relax, enjoy a nice drink, watch a film, etc. That would be awesome. Being the artistic type, I would really like to see something like this happen. Little communities developing culture, enriching the inhabitants. Of course, though, most people only think you can have a good time if you live in a big city, like New York, which means little cities lie fallow in terms of culture and development. I digress, but I think if you give a reason for someone to engage in something that is within walking distance, that would also reduce gas consumption.
Bleh, I blab on. I guess everyone will get back to "Blame Bush" or "Blame the Oil Companies" spiel. I just think that maybe if people would actually do something rather than wait for "everyone to unite in a glorious proletariat revolution," that maybe something would change...
Anyway, perhaps part of the problem is that we have such a developed interstate system. Before, we relied on either airplane or trains to get us across the states. Perhaps if we had grown accustomed to taking other, more public (public in the sense of having to sit with other people) transportation, our perception of transportation would be different.
Granted, Germany has a similar extensive transport system, but they have had public transportation since at least the early twentieth century. I am not phrasing this right, but you know what I mean.
So why not the States? We are a much more individualist country. Urban planning is not really a part of our culture. Look at New York. Talk about a city that was built in a haphazard fashion! But because of it, the city has a unique beauty to it. We plan inasmuch as lay out a proper foundation for a city, but in terms of actually moving the populace or items around, we tend to leave that to individuals. In other words, we supply the means of doing something, but not the actual motive.
To be quite honest, I think we should use this price hike to re-evaluate our connection to automoblies. Perhaps some companies can create some low-cost comfortable transit systems? I think we could make something like that. Americans like things fast, and I'm pretty sure a fast transit system, like a private bus company or similar service, would do well in some cities. While I am well aware of what happened in LA with the Bus system (the auto manufacturers basically threw them out of business), we are in a different situation now, so who knows?
Another facet is that, like what was said before, we live in a big country. Everything is really parced out in comparison to places in Europe. The car, in essence, becomes an extension of our feet in order to cover large distances. The confidence in which people drive in the states is the same as one who walks. Personally, I prefer using my two feet to get me places, but that's just me. I don't think there's anything wrong with such driving habits, save the fact that you don't get the beneficial excercise from it (believe me, walking can really get you in shape).
Perhaps people should start building up their own communities, infuse them with culture and productivity. So that, after work, you can drive home, and them walk around your community to relax, enjoy a nice drink, watch a film, etc. That would be awesome. Being the artistic type, I would really like to see something like this happen. Little communities developing culture, enriching the inhabitants. Of course, though, most people only think you can have a good time if you live in a big city, like New York, which means little cities lie fallow in terms of culture and development. I digress, but I think if you give a reason for someone to engage in something that is within walking distance, that would also reduce gas consumption.
Bleh, I blab on. I guess everyone will get back to "Blame Bush" or "Blame the Oil Companies" spiel. I just think that maybe if people would actually do something rather than wait for "everyone to unite in a glorious proletariat revolution," that maybe something would change...
SkankinMonkey
Established Member
I agree with you on most points. In a few weeks, I'm going to Japan for a year of college. The other guy that's going from my school had this extremely flippant attitude about taking public transportation in Japan, as if riding in a bus was below him (you know, something that poor minorities do). Anyway, people will either learn to cut back and drive less and find alternate routes of transportation, or they will forsake some of the nicities of life until oil disappears completely.
SkankinMonkey
Established Member
Still not as big of a rise as in america, where it was recently under 2 dollars a gallon and is now over 3.